Seriuosly TapsC
You going to take the rights to the word "entitlement" as well and go cry in the corner :roll: :roll:
I guess what you are not comprehending is two things
1)older people may remember the pre-independence days and if your resolution to that is to kick the next white children in their face for what their grandfathers may or may not have done then you are just as bad or even worse then the same pre-independence whites/ndebeles.
2)Many of us have only known a zimbabwe where as a minority we are dealing with racism on a daily occurrence and the black entitlement movement
these are simply facts- but you wouldn't know because it doesn't affect you, you're black. When mugabe told the whites to go back to europe did you even blink or raise your voice in opposition to blatant state sponsored racism? Or did you just snigger s**ts and giggles 😂
As for the subject i can only congratulate Afghanistan on clambering over Zimbabwe by repeatedly thumping us and getting higher up the ladder and respectability. You of course have to wonder how much ZC board got to OK the games.
The Afghans have played their hearts out to the point of exhaustion, they clearly have struggled being homeless and underpaid for ages but despite all the challenges stuffed us in the face and deserve their position.
To step up to the top 4in the world they need to repeat what they did to us with SA.
They'll always have my support :W:
manana
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UAE & Afghanistan tour of Zimbabwe 2019 : Pre Series Discussion
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ZCF OriginalLegend
ZIMDOGGY wrote: ↑Fri Mar 22, 2019 1:07 am
To be fair, Zimbo_5 never said Asia is a perfect place at all, he said he doesn’t care because he identifies as Australian and Asia isn’t somewhere he thinks about.
And Asians do not get treated like second class citizens in Oz at all, they are treated extremely well. That’s why so many migrate here and anyone who lives here would laugh at that statement. To China and the sub continent, Australia is heaven.
I have a feeling he is referring to Asians as people form the sub-continent, not from places like Japan/China/Korea etc etc. I get your point, which still stands.
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Yeah I think so too and yes the point still stands.
As you no Doubt know, it’s weird hearing Indians and such being referred to as ‘Asians’ in Australia. The sub continent is not viewed as asian at all. Separate category for curries.
As you no Doubt know, it’s weird hearing Indians and such being referred to as ‘Asians’ in Australia. The sub continent is not viewed as asian at all. Separate category for curries.
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Wow that escalated quickly in my absence. We’ll never be free of the issue of race here or anywhere in the world it seems. I don’t think you can compare Afghanistan’s success despite their economic and war woes to Zimbabwe. We have a different set of circumstances.
The fundamental difference is this-
Afghanistan is cricket mad, their entire population! They know there’s not enough money coming from their board and they make a plan to play cricket regardless of their circumstances.
Despite what people say here only a very small portion of our country have a real interest in cricket and despite best efforts I don’t think that will change much. We’ve seen time and again that if ZC or corporates don’t basically lay it on no one lifts a finger. There are a few exceptions, but it is what it is. ZC’s grass roots drive has always been dishonest window dressing. They pick up a few decent players but it will never really gain traction. They should have focused on government schools that used to have infrastructure, but they’ve chosen to ignore the obvious. You’ll never get good players without passionate coaches and parents and we lack both.
Our white population and increasingly our black, is mobile and many have the option to flee the dire circumstances that have befallen our beautiful country.
Taps- you can’t say that the white guys get equal treatment here, the reality is that they probably get more than equal treatment, but once dozens have left and only a handful remain that’s a disingenuous statement.
For sure the economy has chased away more people than ZC has, but they’ve played a huge hand nonetheless.
With 10 mil a year we could have had a nucleus of serious young cricketers in the wings, but they’ve chosen to ignore them, partly because there’s more white boys than black, and partly because they just don’t know how to do it and don’t really give a damn. Whilst ICC just keep throwing money at them and there’s no one in the hierarchy that cares enough to use it wisely, why should they?
My best example of ZC not giving a s**t is Muyeye. After decades of praying for a world class black teenage batsman they finally get one (and his development had sweet f%* all to do with ZC!) and they make a token effort to reel him in. It boggles the mind.
With a diabolically managed FC and club system and a plethora of bang average cricketers that they seem intent on keeping on a subsistence lifeline until they die of old age they could still identify a half dozen extremely talented young players and get them playing here at any cost, because our survival depends on it.
The fundamental difference is this-
Afghanistan is cricket mad, their entire population! They know there’s not enough money coming from their board and they make a plan to play cricket regardless of their circumstances.
Despite what people say here only a very small portion of our country have a real interest in cricket and despite best efforts I don’t think that will change much. We’ve seen time and again that if ZC or corporates don’t basically lay it on no one lifts a finger. There are a few exceptions, but it is what it is. ZC’s grass roots drive has always been dishonest window dressing. They pick up a few decent players but it will never really gain traction. They should have focused on government schools that used to have infrastructure, but they’ve chosen to ignore the obvious. You’ll never get good players without passionate coaches and parents and we lack both.
Our white population and increasingly our black, is mobile and many have the option to flee the dire circumstances that have befallen our beautiful country.
Taps- you can’t say that the white guys get equal treatment here, the reality is that they probably get more than equal treatment, but once dozens have left and only a handful remain that’s a disingenuous statement.
For sure the economy has chased away more people than ZC has, but they’ve played a huge hand nonetheless.
With 10 mil a year we could have had a nucleus of serious young cricketers in the wings, but they’ve chosen to ignore them, partly because there’s more white boys than black, and partly because they just don’t know how to do it and don’t really give a damn. Whilst ICC just keep throwing money at them and there’s no one in the hierarchy that cares enough to use it wisely, why should they?
My best example of ZC not giving a s**t is Muyeye. After decades of praying for a world class black teenage batsman they finally get one (and his development had sweet f%* all to do with ZC!) and they make a token effort to reel him in. It boggles the mind.
With a diabolically managed FC and club system and a plethora of bang average cricketers that they seem intent on keeping on a subsistence lifeline until they die of old age they could still identify a half dozen extremely talented young players and get them playing here at any cost, because our survival depends on it.
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Kriterion_BD wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 7:48 am
sam_ahm wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 7:32 am
Looks like Afghanistan backed out because ZC couldn't afford to broadcast the series on TV.
Initially I thought it was the arrogance of ACB, but now I can't really blame them, in present day to say they can't broadcast an international series is quite embarrassing really.
Yeah, the Afghans have a large fanbase and expect that a series against an existing full member be televised. Especially since they are sharing costs. The side benefit might be the Afghans might feel Ireland and Scotland will give them better practice especially in UK conditions.
Where is ZBC in all this
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Some good news at last, Zimbabwe will be touring The Netherlands as part of the European tour in July, no confirmation on the number of games at the moment.
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zimfan1 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:30 pm
Some good news at last, Zimbabwe will be touring The Netherlands as part of the European tour in July, no confirmation on the number of games at the moment.
Surely the Dutch have ODI status as they will be in the new league starting 2020.
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We do really need to cut ties with Afghanistan.
The only benefit we have received is exposure to spin from that grey haired teenager.
They are entitled, think they are better than they are and there’s no value in them touring us or vice versa.
All it’s done is make us lose respect on ten world stage after we get toweled up in middle eastern dustbowls.
The way Zimbabwe play, we will be dismissed for 178 chasing 325 both against Afghanistan or Australia. We give retard teams too much respect and we lose by the same amount to stronger teams regardless if they are slightly better or worlds apart.
We are best to choose our opponents wisely and keep the fixtures ticking and players occupied by playing A teams like TapsC said.
Personally, I think Zim should ensure they play at least one annual test with SA.
Given the SA team have a weighted racial quota, they could use the opportunity to niggerfy their team if they fall behind in their targets, or on the flip side, blood players they are hesistant to do against the top sides. So In essence we get to play a proper test match at C team prices.
The only benefit we have received is exposure to spin from that grey haired teenager.
They are entitled, think they are better than they are and there’s no value in them touring us or vice versa.
All it’s done is make us lose respect on ten world stage after we get toweled up in middle eastern dustbowls.
The way Zimbabwe play, we will be dismissed for 178 chasing 325 both against Afghanistan or Australia. We give retard teams too much respect and we lose by the same amount to stronger teams regardless if they are slightly better or worlds apart.
We are best to choose our opponents wisely and keep the fixtures ticking and players occupied by playing A teams like TapsC said.
Personally, I think Zim should ensure they play at least one annual test with SA.
Given the SA team have a weighted racial quota, they could use the opportunity to niggerfy their team if they fall behind in their targets, or on the flip side, blood players they are hesistant to do against the top sides. So In essence we get to play a proper test match at C team prices.
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ZIMDOGGY wrote: ↑Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:25 am
They are entitled, think they are better than they are and there’s no value in them touring us or vice versa.
Thats unfair on Afghanistan. I agree, they have some cocky players and arrogant fans. But what Asian nation apart from perhaps Sri Lanka don't? I'll be the first to admit, BD fans are terrible. Just like the Pak and Indian ones. And before anyone says that India is the best team in the world, I'd like to remind everyone of the obvious, India's (or Pakistan or Bangladesh or Afghanistan's) rank is no credit to any of their respective fans. Kohli might be a great player, but is he that much better than a Smith or a Warner or a Williamson or a Root? Judging from his on-field antics, one would get that sense.
But Afghanistan have dominated Zimbabwe ever since they have started playing each other back in 2014. Afghanistan have won 22 times across formats, and ZIM have won 10. Except for the most recent encounter in the Qualifiers, anytime there was a pressure situation between them, Afghanistan found a way to come out on top.
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Kriterion_BD wrote: ↑Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:49 am
ZIMDOGGY wrote: ↑Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:25 am
They are entitled, think they are better than they are and there’s no value in them touring us or vice versa.
Thats unfair on Afghanistan. I agree, they have some cocky players and arrogant fans. But what Asian nation apart from perhaps Sri Lanka don't? I'll be the first to admit, BD fans are terrible. Just like the Pak and Indian ones. And before anyone says that India is the best team in the world, I'd like to remind everyone of the obvious, India's (or Pakistan or Bangladesh or Afghanistan's) rank is no credit to any of their respective fans. Kohli might be a great player, but is he that much better than a Smith or a Warner or a Williamson or a Root? Judging from his on-field antics, one would get that sense.
But Afghanistan have dominated Zimbabwe ever since they have started playing each other back in 2014. Afghanistan have won 22 times across formats, and ZIM have won 10. Except for the most recent encounter in the Qualifiers, anytime there was a pressure situation between them, Afghanistan found a way to come out on top.
I agree, Afghans are arrogant to some extent, but we can't take away the fact that they have been an impressive team and considering the situation in Afghanistan over the years, their hard work and rise in cricket must be appreciated.
By the way, great to know that Zimbabwe will play both Netherlands and Ireland... Hopefully they can get a deal done with Scotland as well.
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The other thing is that both Afghanistan and Zimbabwe played each other for reasons of mutual benefit. For AFG it was obvious: one of the rare chances to play a Test nation. For Zimbabwe it was getting to play additional fixtures against a decent but beatable opposition in the hopes that they could translate that experience to the bigger sides. So far, only the Afghans have earned dividends whilst Zimbabwe have not. So its unfair to put the blame squarely on Afghanistan.
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Facts are the following
Zimbabwe was the first and only full member who would host and play Afghanistan on a regular basis (I think Bnagldesh played them for one series)
Afghanistan wanted to play Zimbabwe in Zimbabwe at Harare to prepare themselves for the WC
Afghanistan got a better offer from Pakistan and decided to pull out
Zimbabwe only have themselves to blame though, they really should have won the first Four ODI series played between the two sides, they let slip winnable matches in every series. Maybe if they beat them a few times and didn't f**k up in CWCQ then Afghanistan wouldn't be leaving them behind.
Zimbabwe was the first and only full member who would host and play Afghanistan on a regular basis (I think Bnagldesh played them for one series)
Afghanistan wanted to play Zimbabwe in Zimbabwe at Harare to prepare themselves for the WC
Afghanistan got a better offer from Pakistan and decided to pull out
Zimbabwe only have themselves to blame though, they really should have won the first Four ODI series played between the two sides, they let slip winnable matches in every series. Maybe if they beat them a few times and didn't f**k up in CWCQ then Afghanistan wouldn't be leaving them behind.
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jaybro wrote: ↑Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:06 am
Facts are the following
Zimbabwe was the first and only full member who would host and play Afghanistan on a regular basis (I think Bnagldesh played them for one series)
Afghanistan wanted to play Zimbabwe in Zimbabwe at Harare to prepare themselves for the WC
Afghanistan got a better offer from Pakistan and decided to pull out
Zimbabwe only have themselves to blame though, they really should have won the first Four ODI series played between the two sides, they let slip winnable matches in every series. Maybe if they beat them a few times and didn't f**k up in CWCQ then Afghanistan wouldn't be leaving them behind.
Bangladesh hosted Afghanistan once for 3 ODIs (as preparation for the England tour - so all bilateral series are involve mutual self interest) and toured India last year for 3 T20Is.
Are AFG and PAK supposed to play a series? Hard to believe because PCB and ACB are not on good terms.
I don't think ZIM's standing was the critical factor. Yes, the Afghans probably feel they are the better side, but I doubt they would ignore ZIM because who else will they play?
The critical factor was ZIM's inability/unwillingness to broadcast the series properly.
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It doesn't help that ZC has to ask countries to "pay their own way". Apart from Afghanistan and Ireland none of the other countries have the money to do it, and for the AFG/IRE teams they at least feel that should they win, they can increase their profile.
To be honest, the Test fund should have been retained in this new ICC remodel. At any rate, the leading Associates have organized a lot of LOI cricket in the past few years. They should seek a profitable venue to organize regular quadrangular tournaments. Matches in Nepal would be heavily attended, and all teams could earn their fair share, with the hosts getting the lion's share of course.
Imagine Netherlands, Scotland, Nepal, Zimbabwe, UAE, PNG/HK playing regular tournaments. That would ensure 3-5 ODIs for each team every 4 months.
To be honest, the Test fund should have been retained in this new ICC remodel. At any rate, the leading Associates have organized a lot of LOI cricket in the past few years. They should seek a profitable venue to organize regular quadrangular tournaments. Matches in Nepal would be heavily attended, and all teams could earn their fair share, with the hosts getting the lion's share of course.
Imagine Netherlands, Scotland, Nepal, Zimbabwe, UAE, PNG/HK playing regular tournaments. That would ensure 3-5 ODIs for each team every 4 months.
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I’m not to defend ZC but they did organise 9 ODI’s to fill in the gap before the Ireland tour, it’s not their fault that Afghanistan have pulled out on them.
In saying that the reason apprently is that the Afghanistan board wanted the games televised but ZC could only afford a live stream. It’s really not good enough from ZC, in today’s world where just about any sport is available at the touch of a smart phone that they can’t televise a series between two full members. I’ve said it before but I still don’t understand how in a country where cricket is the No.2 sport they can’t market the product and atleast break even?
It’s up to ZC to now find some other side to play, I’d be looking to engage Scotland or Netherlands for ODI tours whilst the boys are in Europe.
In saying that the reason apprently is that the Afghanistan board wanted the games televised but ZC could only afford a live stream. It’s really not good enough from ZC, in today’s world where just about any sport is available at the touch of a smart phone that they can’t televise a series between two full members. I’ve said it before but I still don’t understand how in a country where cricket is the No.2 sport they can’t market the product and atleast break even?
It’s up to ZC to now find some other side to play, I’d be looking to engage Scotland or Netherlands for ODI tours whilst the boys are in Europe.
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To be honest this year is a 1-off because we didn't qualify for the world cup. There is no need to beg Afghanistan for games. Let them do what they need to do. We shouldn't devalue ourselves. Their players didnt want to play against us anyway according to some people.
There is no need to group us with Nepal Hong Kong UAE etc. We are not that terrible guys. The ODI league is around the corner. There is no need to be desperate. People are quick to forget we are the country that played the most ODIs last year.
We should be focusing on the future and what kind of team we are going to have in the ODI league. Instead of begging a team that now think they are world beaters yet they were very lucky to qualify, lets rather organize a few A tours against some proper teams.
What to do we learn with BT and co bashing the UAE or playing Afghanistan again? I would rather we use the little resources we have to bring in the SA A team and test the likes of Kamunhukamwe Jakiel and Masuku. That's a real learning curve.
Also the Afghanistan thing is a big lesson. Going forward we shouldnt help anybody. Lets not invite Nepal etc. Let them figure out the cricket world by themselves.
Afghanistan forget they still need to play test cricket. From now going forward we shouldnt help them. They have shown their true colours. Let them get games against other teams. With the ODI league guaranteeing games we dont need them. They are ungrateful and I wont forget the racist comments their fans were making when their team was in serious trouble during the qualifiers. Let Sri Lanka Bangladesh India and Pakistan play them instead of us. Since they are that good now in their minds.
There is no need to group us with Nepal Hong Kong UAE etc. We are not that terrible guys. The ODI league is around the corner. There is no need to be desperate. People are quick to forget we are the country that played the most ODIs last year.
We should be focusing on the future and what kind of team we are going to have in the ODI league. Instead of begging a team that now think they are world beaters yet they were very lucky to qualify, lets rather organize a few A tours against some proper teams.
What to do we learn with BT and co bashing the UAE or playing Afghanistan again? I would rather we use the little resources we have to bring in the SA A team and test the likes of Kamunhukamwe Jakiel and Masuku. That's a real learning curve.
Also the Afghanistan thing is a big lesson. Going forward we shouldnt help anybody. Lets not invite Nepal etc. Let them figure out the cricket world by themselves.
Afghanistan forget they still need to play test cricket. From now going forward we shouldnt help them. They have shown their true colours. Let them get games against other teams. With the ODI league guaranteeing games we dont need them. They are ungrateful and I wont forget the racist comments their fans were making when their team was in serious trouble during the qualifiers. Let Sri Lanka Bangladesh India and Pakistan play them instead of us. Since they are that good now in their minds.
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Zimbabwe don't need Afghanistan now that they're rubbing shoulders with the up and coming giants of world cricket, Nigeria! :D
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TapsC wrote: ↑Sun Mar 10, 2019 6:11 am
To be honest this year is a 1-off because we didn't qualify for the world cup. There is no need to beg Afghanistan for games. Let them do what they need to do. We shouldn't devalue ourselves. Their players didnt want to play against us anyway according to some people.
There is no need to group us with Nepal Hong Kong UAE etc. We are not that terrible guys. The ODI league is around the corner. There is no need to be desperate. People are quick to forget we are the country that played the most ODIs last year.
We should be focusing on the future and what kind of team we are going to have in the ODI league. Instead of begging a team that now think they are world beaters yet they were very lucky to qualify, lets rather organize a few A tours against some proper teams.
What to do we learn with BT and co bashing the UAE or playing Afghanistan again? I would rather we use the little resources we have to bring in the SA A team and test the likes of Kamunhukamwe Jakiel and Masuku. That's a real learning curve.
Also the Afghanistan thing is a big lesson. Going forward we shouldnt help anybody. Lets not invite Nepal etc. Let them figure out the cricket world by themselves.
Afghanistan forget they still need to play test cricket. From now going forward we shouldnt help them. They have shown their true colours. Let them get games against other teams. With the ODI league guaranteeing games we dont need them. They are ungrateful and I wont forget the racist comments their fans were making when their team was in serious trouble during the qualifiers. Let Sri Lanka Bangladesh India and Pakistan play them instead of us. Since they are that good now in their minds.
I think you're kidding yourself a bit here. Teams would jump at the opportunity to play Zim at one stage. Teams would even use Zim as their training ground, and in a World Cup year and just before competing in a World Cup, you would jump at the opportunity to play games against a test playing nation.
We played the most ODIs but what has that got us. Our ranking hasn't improved. We are not in the World Cup. We have a board with no clue, and an over the hill captain.
Remember we lost to UAE last year. So bashing them is not a guarantee. If we don't have the resources for our national team, then we certainly do not have the resources for the A side tours. Unfortunately, we need to be blooding our younger players in the national side. Jakiel is already 28. He has not been given his chance until now and even then I have my concerns about it all.
We are not in a position to not be helping sides like Afghanistan, because the other 9 sides in the WC don't really want to have anything to do with Zim Cricket at the moment. the ICC couldnt care about as well. They keep us on to push their narrative that the sport is growing when in actual fact they limit the shows grand event to only include the big teams. The World Cup is essentially a Champions Trophy under the guise of a 'World' event.
I am not a fan of Afghanistan or their fans, but they could do without us. They have players playing in big T20 leagues across the globe. They are in the World Cup at our expense. They are not just matching us on the field, but beating us as well. They are at times pushing the big teams and matching it with them on their day. They have resources and a board that is not stealing their money. This all from a country that is war ravaged and really should not be able to be at the standard they are at.
Sad to say, but ZC really have screwed the pooch on this one. We really shouldn't be in this mess. I don't see why they don't just swallow their pride and give the game back to the non-blacks.
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